David Byers
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The Government today announced that the incapacity benefit system was being abolished in a radical tightening of the welfare system designed to ensure that thousands are taken off “the sick” and back into work.
In a hard-hitting speech to the House of Commons, James Purnell, the Work and Pensions Secretary, said that the reforms were designed to end the idea that there was a choice between benefits and work, adding: "life on benefits is not an option."
In what Mr Purnell claimed was the biggest shake-up of the welfare state since the 1940s, all those on incapacity benefit will be forced to undergo medical tests to determine their capacity to return to employment, and only full-time carers and disabled people "with the greatest needs" will remain exempt from finding work.
Incapacity benefit will itself be abolished all together by 2013 and income support will also be scrapped, with a simplified system of two benefits replacing them: Employment Support Allowance for those with medical problems which limit their ability to work, and JobSeekers’ Allowance for those who are fit to work.
Jobless people who take drugs will be banned from receiving dole money unless they accept treatment, Mr Purnell added, while unemployed drug addicts who lie to get benefits will be forced to repay the money and could face jail.
Lone parents with children aged 7 or more will be expected to seek work, while the long-term unemployed will face US-style "work for dole" programmes requiring them to undertake useful activities to ensure that they make a "fair contribution" in return for state support.
In addition, private companies which win contracts to help people find jobs could be paid from the resulting savings in benefits.
Mr Purnell said that the changes were needed because the welfare state had not kept pace with changes in society, with the "nadir" reached in the 1980s when all conditions were removed from unemployment benefit.
Announcing a system which he proposed would make those on benefits justify and earn their claims, he said: "The longer people claim, the more we will expect in return. At three months and six months, claimants will intensify their job search and have to comply with a back to work action plan."
He added: "We will give our advisers the power to use full-time work as a sanction at any stage of a claim for those who are abusing the system.
"We will improve treatment for those who have a problem with crack cocaine and opiates, but require them to take up that treatment. Work works and it is only fair that we make sure a life on benefits is not an option."
The Welfare Green Paper aims for a record 80 per cent employment rate — up from the current 75 per cent — and makes clear that there will be "no right to a life on benefits" for anyone capable of working.
The initiative had threatened to place Mr Purnell in a difficult situation politically, amid fears that the plans would encounter opposition from some on the Labour Left opposed to any squeeze in the benefits system.
However, this afternoon it appeared that any opposition would be confined primarily to a fringe of serial rebels, with much of the mainstream of the party behind the Government — the plans were drafted by ministers co-operating closely with backbenchers.
The Government has already been assured of support from the Conservatives, with shadow ministers claiming that many of the proposals had been "lifted" from Tory proposals made in January.
"Since these are Conservative proposals, we will certainly support them," Chris Grayling, the Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary, said, in a speech replying to Mr Purnell's proposals.
"I know you will have some difficulties getting them through your own party. Can I assure you we will help you get them through this House even if you have a backbench rebellion to contend with."
Earlier, in an attempt to show clear water between Labour's plans and those of the Tories, Mr Purnell had claimed that his plans were inherently socialist in principle and pledged that Labour would "never, ever" stigmatise the jobless.
"I think that people who see the way incapacity benefit or drug addiction or deep unemployment can scar communities are desperate to turn that round, and when I speak to my colleagues they want a system that provides support for people, but also responsibility," he said.
"What the Tories want to do is to be responsible but not to provide the support. David Cameron wants to get rid of the tax credits which would help people to be lifted out of poverty and to get on. We want to provide both, and that’s an approach which lots of my Labour colleagues wholeheartedly back."
He added: "I’m saying ’support and responsibility’, and if people don’t live up to that expectation ... then of course people can lose their benefits.
"For people who are looking for work, we will be saying to people if they play the system that they will have to work to get their benefits."
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Why is it written with the assumption that everyone on benifits is ripping off the government. Those on benifits are people too, who would rather they were healthy enough to work and live a regular life. I would agree whole heartidly with the ..if you're useing illegal drugs, you get no help..
Ester , London ,
It's laughable that so many posters regard this as a "threat" or "punishment". Taxation is backed by threats of punishment, because it is theft of one's property. You are the recipients of that stolen property. Nothing is being taken from you - they will merely channel stolen funds elsewhere.
Andy, New York City, USA
The Goverment should watch Shameless!!!!!
mark, Leeds,
I'd prefer to see plans to stop government ministers and Mp's ripping off state.funds..
fred, ballymoney, Northern Ireland
Wow new legislation to turn the unemployed into a ready source of slave labor.
How very new lab! Tony would be so proud.
So all these people will be effectively told "If you want to eat you work" nice and just in time for the surge in unemployment caused by the economic chaos.
al, london, uk
Those made redundant after decades of steady employment and tax-paying must expect nothing back. It's gone on ministerial self-indulgence and MP's index-linked pensions. That this should come from any Labour government marks the death of compassion and fair play. Long live government by greed.
richard, horley,
GREAT IDEA about time something was done to get the lazy doleys back to work youll get my vote
Carl, dumfries, dumfrieshire
Any full time work that jobseekers are expected to do on a 'work for welfare' scheme should be paid at least minimum wage for the duration -just as if it were any other job. Expecting people to work full time for just £60 or so sounds like exploitation.
Erin, London, London
Its time to dismantle the whole system,l know of a family where not one member has done days work in Forty years,yet they own a car,and just retured from a holiday in America,while l struggle on my civil service pension,why should anyone work when they live so well on the system,
KENNETH BOWRY, LONDON,
Bravo...about time this poor excuse for a government tried to address a gripe of the common worker in this country. Namely scroungers taking their hard earned tax's for absolutly no effort.
It's just a shame that it wasn't their idea... it's too much like leadership to be their's.
Daniel, Gloucester,
This will be the Reconstruction and Reclamation Corps, the 'Reeks and Wrecks', that Kurt Vonnegut prophesised over 50 years ago in 'Player Piano'.
Paul, Coventry,
Very sensible proposals in principle, as ever, the devil will be in the detail. It's already an absolute nightmare for people with conditions such as ME/CFS to get benefits (I know, I have the illness and don't receive a penny), I hope things aren't about to get even worse.
Michael, Carlisle, UK
I don't mind doing some work for the Job Seekers Allowance. However, in just getting 1/3 or so of the minimum wage, I predict some unemployed people might take the Government to the European Court of Justice if this work is as tough as a normal job. Would the Gov would want to triple the JSA bill ?
Nick, London,
If the government is becoming a business then why have a government?
I bet these measures only alienate those who deserve benefits and help those who can and will defraud to continue to do so.
What a sad sad and to the once proud labour party!
Herny adams, Manchester, UK
The theory behind the action against people with disabilities is that they are protected by,and helped into work through the Disability Discrimination Acts. In fact only 5% of cases reaching Employment Tribunals are decided in favour of the complainant.
Jim, Corwen, UK
Pay the minimum wage and call it a job. Otherwise it's just the workhouse reinvented.
Rachel, Bristol, UK
how many people really and truly need to be on benefits? an estimate would be about 50-60% of the current total. any other guesses? and the gov should only pay for you to bring up one child, any others you choose to have is your own decision and i'm not paying for it!
Alex, london, england
Where are all additional these jobs coming from? There ios over 2 million unemployed who can work but cannot find jobs? Anyway if they are forced to work they will be intitled to minium wage payments and holidays, it would appear that the goverment needs to think before shooting itsself in the foot
John, Weymouth,
Look at ACC in New Zealand. It helps people (with lots of support) back to work after injuries. You often find those who are off work due to illness and injury want to be active members of the working society but need help or assistance to get there. I hope this will be offered!
Carolyn, London,
Of course people receiving these benefits will squeal. As long as there are safeguards for genuinely ill & genuine carers the rest need to learn that the free ride is over. When 3 generations of families have never worked yet continue to have children they cannot afford something has to change.
Donna Walker, Effingham, England
Labour are getting a God complex, let the cripples walk and the blind see. By all means let those that want to work do it but the costs of all these private advisors and adaptions will cost more than the savings, especially when the person has to quit after a couple of week due to ill health.
am, letchworth,
Once again the Government is picking on the weak and vunerable members of society, and many comments finally agree with them on something. What a wonderful society Blair and Brown have produced.
Those genuinly disabled do not need the additional stress of being labelled malingers!
am, letchworth,
If a government minister cannot understand why "... at a time when three million extra jobs have been created in the economy - the workless roll call has fallen by less than half a million," then he's vastly overpaid. Britain's legal immigrants are more eager to work than are her native sons.
Dennis Eagan, Colorado Springs,
Is there jobs to go round? with all those on incapacity benefit, Job Seekers Allowance or otherwise will be competing against those immigrants who come over for jobs and except less pay, just as thousands of people are being made redundant in the construction industry!!!
Wendy Radford-Gaby, Helston, UK
J.Wilkes, Gloucester,
The problem with re-assessments in the current system is dishonest doctors. I was told of a doctor who signs off people in his ethnic community as disabled when they are not. Presumably he does the re-assessment! One couple were boasting of installing a 40k bathroom using IB!
Charan Muzaya, London, UK
Thatcher took on the miners ( read "the unions"). Stern medicine but good for the country. I want to see a prime minister taking on the legions of drug addicts and daytime drinkers & unwell golf players that are a cancer on our society.
Send the long-term unemployed to Iraq.
frank, slough, uk
I have continued to work without interruption for 45yrs,never claimed dole/benefits(except family allow),what happens to me if i was to be made redundant?.I think the Govt should introduce a credit system where your past contributions are taken in to account,food vouchers for the idle with no contri
Kenneth O'Boyle, Perth, UK
My daughter, now 28, has had ME since she was 13 years old.She has been on IB, refused it, on it again, yet her health has not changed. For those genuinely ill with long term untreatable or non improving conditions, how easy will it be to prove you cannot work? -the stress will make people worse.
Margaret, Glenrothes, UK
All this is doing is penalizing the already vulnerable!! It's stressful and demeaning enough being in a position that you are unable to work and help your family. All this will do is make people worse.! What is the point of the medics who already assess those claming IB?Isn't that their job!!???
Nicola , Chesterfield,
Personally I think this is a great idea by the government, and long overdue as well, we have become a nation of spongers and where work shyness has become common place, where the working class of this nation as been slowly turned into the benefit class. Gordon Brown you have finally done something that is good for this country, good on you.
Jason, Leeds,
Under Thatcher, unemployed people were encouraged to go on to incapacity benefit to keep the unemployed statistics low. Now, 2008, we will be moving them from incapacity to jobseekers allowance. Going Into recession, stand by for the jobseekers statistics to shoot up. Inevitable.
Alison Bell, Hamilton,
This is entirely sensible - if you can work you should not be discouraged from doing so. If you can't, you should be supported. As long as the testing is reliable, there should be no problem. We cannot continue to have communities in England and Wales where it is the norm not to work.
David John Marusza, Cardiff, Wales
There is only one way to deal with the problem of benefit dependancy. It is to anounce that all benifits will cease on the 1st April 2009. have a panel in each parish of a Doctor Policemen and a
person in work
no benefits without their approval.
You will see a huge reduction in applicants
Pat Hallifax, Southampton, UK
I currently work at a job centre and everyday greeted by apparently incapacitated individuals; in my oppinion only a minority have genuine need for the benefit, the others are there as a result of alcoholism and drug abuse. Medicals are conducted but they merely serve to diagnose rather than treat.
Daniel, Woodstock, England
depression or schizophrenia arent incapacitating, if there are drugs available that can make the person function normally then they clearly arent incapacitated.
if someone has heart disease or is paralysed fair enough dont do physical work, but surely they are still capable of office work
will, grimsby, uk
I was on IB, I went back to work, my new employers made my life a misery, saying that I was too slow etc to do my job as quickly say as a able bodied person. They made it so awkward for me that I left. I claim IB, but I dont mind going back to work if the job was right for me.
Ms Hilary Rowley, Essex, United Kingdom
I've not worked now for several years due to a serious heart condition. Despite suffering 6 heart attacks and 3 strokes I am unsuitable for bypass surgery due to a condition called acute ectasia vessels. Does the governent seriously think I am fit for work... IF ONLY! Who's going to employ me.??
Brian Roberts, Kidderminster, UK
Will they be firing the existing litter lickers and graffiti removers to employ these benefits people, or will the caouncil have to pay another set of wages by employing both?
Sue Doughty, Twyford, UK
I run a training and placement agency. I have done very well financially out of Government schemes. The prospect of 'reform' is making me rub my hands with glee!!!!
Chris, Croydon, UK
ME????? skiveritus , we all have ME ... sorry i have people with no Arms who work.. sorry computer says no .. get some courage get back out their.. ME wasn't around during the blitz was it?
lee harrison, leeds, uk
What the government is in denial about is that there really are not enough jobs to go round especially as they are importing people from abroad to do the ones we do have.
Also the fact the unemployment benefits often pay a lot more than working especially when housing benefit is taken into account.
Gill Turner, Cornwall, Truro, England
Agree with all the plans - as one lady has said 'ABOUT TIME TOO!' It's the planning and implementation that should be properly thought out now.
Now can we tackle Immigration and Legal sentencing reforms??!!
Pete Lake, Wakefield,
They will have to be paid minimum wage to work , could mean a pay rise for claimants. Also if earning min wage they may also get tax credits lol.
John, Bristol, UK
Much more money is wasted on trying to get people into work, so called training, job courses, private firms getting £3000 a week to tell someone think positively and seeing a job advisor to look at the jobs that you can look at without their help. it will cost 50X more to keep a person in prison
Darren, Plymouth,
George Edwards, I'm sorry your wife is not well but you've stated yourself that you are in Spain. This leads me to believe you're doing alright and not contributing any tax (income, VAT etc) to the UK gov't. So why, exactly, should we continue to provide benefits to you? The system is too lax.
Matt, Didcot,
It's a great idea but let's be honest the do-gooders, politically correct monkeys and born again social workers/ other; between them all will find reasons why people still can't work. "but this will lead to stress", "we can't allow them to work becuase". This will be a painful battle for us all...
Richard, Bristol, UK
I have ME/CFS (the sort of condition that many would describe as "lazyitis") and receive IB. To all those who think I am workshy, just let me say I will swap places with any of you. I'd give you just 2 weeks before you change your mind, nevermind the 4 years I have suffered.
Alex, Salisbury, UK
I don't mind returning to work even though I am medically incapable. I just hope my new employer won't mind all the additional administration that will have to bed undertaken due to the inevitable unscheduled absences my condition will cause. And the unfair dismissal case likely to follow.
Alex, Salisbury, UK
The government can't wave a magic wand and suddenly declare those who are genuinely unfit to work well again. And what employers are going to give those who have been unwell for years, and who will likely require a significant amount of sick time off because they aren't fit, jobs?
John McClelland, Ballymena, Antrim
Are then any jobs available for the masses of people with genuine conditions like schizophrenia? whose liable if these people become erratic in the workplace & cause a accident?
kevin, Lincoln, UK
So is the government saying people on incapacity / disability benefit could work all along ? if so why were they not made to work I suspect it more to do with political / economical massaging of data to make the government look good So now the cupboard is bare Inclusion is the thing Torchlit parade?
Richard Bridgman, Havant, England
Alcoholics get a lot of extra money, why?? Drug addicts get extra money, why?? Physically fit people get incapacity for being depressed and I'm talking years! Why?
My father in law has tried to claim incapacity after THREE STROKES, only to be treated with suspicion. We are in one hell of a mess!
Graham, St. Albans, uk
Finally! Though one can't help feeling this idea appeared on the times a few days ago from Cameron? Well at least they are trying to do something, people living off the dole are insufferable whilst the rest of us go to work. The drugs treatment is also a fantastic idea. Shape up or ship out!
melissa, Reading,
About bloody time too!!
Kevin, Helensburgh, UK
IB claimants ALREADY undergo medical exams to gauge their illness. I know because I've had 2. The "doctor" decided that my heart condition didn't exist but that I was deaf.
The people playing the system are those who work as well. Catch them and the system is fine. This punishes the genuinely ill.
J.Wilkes, Gloucester,
Why are the Government not so tough when giving free handouts to newly arrived immigrants who have never paid a penny into the system? I am sick (thanks to NHS failures), and have to constantly live under threat of having my benefits stopped.
Steve, Kent, UK
I hoppe the millions of workshy scroungers who get found out will be forced to repay the money they have stolen from us taxpayers.
ben foster, wokingham,
It doesn't matter what different benefits government brings in, the system of testing the disabled doesn't work, and won't work in future. The system provides doctors with incentive to get people off the higher benefit rate. It has little to do with capacity for work, more to do with targets.
Robert Jones, Ventnor, UK
The labour backbenchers fear for their seats.
6 million people on benefits = 6 million labour votes
A Harris, Kettering, UK
On the last "incapacity drive" an "assessor" told my wife that as she had been ill for a while, it was time she got better. He cut off support to "encourage" her. It took three years to sort that mess out. She is still unable to work. This will be driven by cash targets and will be unfair and chaos
George Edwards, Cuevas de San Marcos, Spain
I think this is a good plan but the concept of welfare and intelligent state will undermine. UK will be no more welfare and intelligent state. Crime will increase and there would be more criminal networks in the country.
Musa Khan Jalalzai, London, UK